The Lunch Club Podcast
A space for wedding vendors and creatives. We are offering you a seat at the table as we share all the behind the scenes and details to get you feeling creative and celebrated.
The Lunch Club Podcast
Growing Your Business Through Vendor + Client Relations With Jenny Pearl Photography
This episode covers all the big questions! How to grow your business, creating better vendor. experiences, setting yourself up for success with clients, and more!
Find Jenny on Instagram @ jennypearlphotography and check out her upcoming workshop HERE
Welcome to the Lunch Club Podcast, a space I've created for entrepreneurs. Come sit with us as we share the highs and lows of building and maintaining successful businesses. I'm your host, andrey Zahoggan, and let's get into it. Okay, I am here with Jenny Pearl Photography and I'm super excited. Go ahead and tell us a little bit about you and what services you offer. All the good stuff.
Speaker 2:Hello, I'm Jenny and I've been doing photography for seven years, kind of full time. That's crazy, that's a long time I know it doesn't feel that long, but yes, I started in I don't even know the year, but it's been like seven years and then I specialize in weddings and couples. But I do literally everything. I've done real estate, I've done births, I've done everything you can kind of think of, but I specialize in weddings.
Speaker 1:And then you do offer like do you do workshops for other photographers too, right?
Speaker 2:So I do a lot of workshops education which I kind of just got into more recently. This is my third year of doing workshops. Do you enjoy it?
Speaker 1:I think it's so fun. I love teaching and I don't know why I love teaching.
Speaker 2:I hate the aspect of selling and I feel like that part I don't love. But after I get the tickets sold then I'm like let's do this.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's like a lot of pressure running. I also hate feeling like a salesperson. I'm like I don't want to pressure you.
Speaker 2:Exactly when I'm like. If you want to buy, buy, but if not, that's fine.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and then you're like, oh what if no one buys it?
Speaker 2:I hate that aspect or no one's going to show up to your party.
Speaker 1:Yes, that part is not fun, no, it's crazy.
Speaker 2:I love everything else I love about doing the education part.
Speaker 1:That's super fun. So what made you want to start your business? What made you be like yes, I love the chaos of weddings.
Speaker 2:I honestly didn't even think I would start photography.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it wasn't ever something that. It was something that interested me because I had a sister all growing up that did photography and I was like, okay, this looks fun and she would just use us as her little giddy pigs for models and stuff.
Speaker 1:So I was like this looks fun.
Speaker 2:So I got a camera, like I think it was in 2016, and I just did it for fun, here and there. Just random stuff, yeah, for my family and random stuff, and I actually went to school for physical therapy assisting, wow and so I thought I was just going to do the healthcare field. Definitely a turn Way different. So I did that for a while and then I just did photography on the side for fun, and then I kind of just picked up and I was like, oh, I can make money off of this Right.
Speaker 1:I feel like that's a lot of wedding vendors. It's kind of funny. I feel like it's rarely our first choice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like not in a bad way, but it's like.
Speaker 1:it's like oh yeah, you can make money.
Speaker 2:This can't be a career. I'm not like what I do Exactly.
Speaker 1:I think rarely you can get both yeah.
Speaker 2:I feel like it's over-lucky that we like doing that.
Speaker 1:I know exactly it's genuinely my hobby, but it's a profitable hobby.
Speaker 2:Exactly, and that's where it ended up being the perfect career, because, especially right as I started having kids, it's when I kind of shifted all into photography.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, and I feel like it's perfect because it's like a lot of weekends so it's not as hard to like get help yeah.
Speaker 2:Your schedule is just kind of the opposite of the husband. Exactly, it works out nice.
Speaker 1:It's like the ideal and I feel like a lot of the computer work for me. I'm like, well, I can just be sitting on the couch and answering all my emails, yeah exactly I don't need to go somewhere to do it. It works really well. Okay, so what would you say is one of your biggest pain points in the photography industry, like either right now or just generally?
Speaker 2:I feel like trying to be relevant on social media kind of sucks Amen. Trying to like keep up with all the trends and like the algorithm and posting every single day, or else your business just slowly sinks if you are absent on social media. Seriously, and that part, I feel like it's just hard to keep up, and the other one I feel like just the market is so crazy. Yes, keeping up with the market and like Utah's market is just so different.
Speaker 2:It really is, than any other state where I'm like you get people to charge in super high and then you get people charging hardly anything. It's so frustrating. And then clients are just like well, which one do I go with?
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, and I feel like. Then it creates this mentality of like, oh, people are ripping me off because and you're like no, I know, this is actually how much it costs. I just actually want to make money. And you know so and so is hard. And I feel like it's hard because I think I was there. I was in the position of like. I'm charged so cheap, so people will book me when you're just starting out.
Speaker 1:And I feel like it's hard to recognize, like, oh, but I still have a value. Exactly, I'm better than this Susie's aunt who is going to be the alternative.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and a lot of clients like they don't see through that very well. So then it makes it hard to like justify why you're charging what you're charging versus this other person.
Speaker 1:So defeating when someone like I feel like it's like extra salt in the wound with someone's like well, this person gave me a quote for this, much yeah you're like that's good. I know I'm sad for me, but also I'm really sad for that person who is not making any money. So that's something that in the floral industry we've been working really hard to be really open about what people? Should charge. Just because we're like, you hurt the whole market.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's how it is when you don't hurt.
Speaker 1:And people just don't get it. Like I'm like it's just silly right, like if you could be making the same amount as your best friend like, why would?
Speaker 2:you not? I know that's where I'm sitting. Like some people, though, would rather take 50 weddings and make the same amount. It's crazy. Then just charge a little more and take 25 weddings where I'm like I can't imagine how overwhelming editing would be in that scenario.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like I don't even know. I have so many galleries like that takes so much time. Yeah, not that I really know, but like.
Speaker 2:It is, it's time consuming and I'm like people need to charge more.
Speaker 1:I feel like we kind of talked about this. So what's something you really love about your job?
Speaker 2:I feel like I love working with people. I'm like a very people person and so I love getting to know the couples, getting to know their love story, getting to know their families. It's funny.
Speaker 1:I feel the same way. Oh really, yeah, like it's just so fun. It's so fun, just sweet people?
Speaker 2:Yeah, because I love learning about different people and their stories. So, I feel like that part is super fun for me.
Speaker 1:Well, and I just feel like weddings are such a fun happy time. Like yes, there's a lot of stress and chaos.
Speaker 2:But it's such an exciting day, but it's literally their happiest day, and so you get to like peek into that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's about the booking process or maybe like a client's day of timeline Things that clients don't take into consideration.
Speaker 2:I feel like the lighting part is something that clients don't really think about Because, like with winter weddings, the sun sets out like four or five. So then like most summer weddings, they want to start the ceremony around like four or five. But then, when it comes to winter, they're like, oh, let's just start the ceremony at five.
Speaker 1:I'm like no, it'll be dark.
Speaker 2:So trying to like keep in the lighting consideration, which I feel like I'm really good about, just communicating with my clients.
Speaker 1:So do you usually tell your client about like yeah?
Speaker 2:I'd be like the sun sets at this time on your wedding day. I would plan for your ceremony to at least be at this time so you have enough time after the ceremony to take all your family photos before it gets dark. Yes, so, winter, it's like you have to like have a really early ceremony.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, well, I think it's just again one of those things your clients not thinking about, especially if they're getting engaged Exactly. They're not going to think about that July yeah.
Speaker 2:They're just like oh, dinner is around seven, so let's have our ceremony at like four or five.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh. Yeah, You're like yes, yes. These are the things that I think about that no one else. That no one else. These keep me up at night, and no one else cares.
Speaker 2:Take your family photos in the dark.
Speaker 1:I mean, you can, you're just going to have the flash.
Speaker 2:You're not going to love them, it's not going to be as cute oh for sure, because I've definitely done it and I'm like, ok, this isn't cute, it's not the ideal scenario. It's not the ideal.
Speaker 1:Ok, so we kind of talked about social media, so this might be along that group of things, but what is something that you feel like helped grow your business in meeting your goals or what's helped you stand out in booking, because I feel like you're a name that a lot of people know and I feel like a lot of times it's hard for someone who's just starting and they're like how am. I ever going to get there so any easy tips or just generally what's worked for you in that growing your business?
Speaker 2:For me. I feel like it had to do with a lot with how I showed up for weddings, Really. So the social media aspect is awesome. Just being super consistent, showing your face, showing your personality and trying to grow your social media definitely helps. But I feel like the bigger thing that helped me get more weddings was actually creating relationship with my clients, the vendors, and that I feel like got me more weddings than social media really. Wow. That's like really so I don't feel like it's necessarily the followers that helps you get weddings. It's more of outside of that and how you show up to your weddings, Because I have friends that only have 2,000 followers and they're fully booked out Because they are so good at showing up for their weddings and having those relationships. So I feel like when people see a photography account and they have all these followers, that immediately thinks peer success.
Speaker 1:But it's just funny. I was talking to another friend of mine about this. It's like a lot of people value their success at what their Instagram looks like, whether, like you said, followers assuming like oh well, unless I have 10,000 followers, I'm not legitimate or people aren't going to want to book me, I'm like, but a lot of those followers like clearly 10,000 people aren't booking you.
Speaker 2:No exactly, and I feel like you shouldn't even base your worth or how much you should charge based on your followers either, like you should show, like base it off of what work you're providing and what experience you're providing for your clients, and not your follower account, because I feel like people with so much worth on their follower account and I'm like that's not how it is.
Speaker 1:I'm not going to pay the bills.
Speaker 2:It's your art and how you take care of your clients and your client experience, that's going to get you bigger weddings. And if you build those relationships with, like, all the vendors, the clients, they're going to tell all their friends, the vendors are going to refer you and that's, I feel like that's like a real person.
Speaker 1:Yes exactly.
Speaker 2:And people are going to take word of mouth over. Oh, you have this many followers, you must be legit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I think it's like a better way to look at it. I had like a full social media meltdown in the summer where I was like nothing I do is getting traction on Instagram and it just felt like I was putting so much time into it where? I was like this is not fun and I'm so miserable. And then I had to take a step back and look at it as, like this is really just my portfolio. Like this isn't need to be like. Feeling like this is generating clients Like this is just where I'm going to put the stuff.
Speaker 1:I'm proud of. Where people can see what you do. Yeah and I will get, because I started asking clients as well, like how did you hear about me? I took me forever to do this and I don't know why I didn't start asking sooner.
Speaker 1:But I would say, like over 50% of them say it's a referral from a friend and I had a client book recently actually, from like she said the bride who referred her was someone from like four years ago, like not even a recent wedding, where I'm like wow, like I'm so glad that four years ago, four years ago, is still like bringing clients you never know what impact you'll have on a client or the vendors they work with, that they'll think of you again, and I'm just so glad you brought that up because I feel like it's something people don't.
Speaker 1:Yes, they think so much about like I need to book people, unless about like how am I gonna show up?
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly, and like if you're taking good care of them, they're gonna refer you to other people, and if you're just doing an okay job, they're not gonna remember you, it's just gonna be like oh yep, she took our photos.
Speaker 1:Yeah, she did what I wanted to do. They're good. I think that's the thing, like if you do something a little above and beyond.
Speaker 2:Yeah, above the expectations, then they're really excited. They're really gonna remember you.
Speaker 1:Okay, what is your favorite? Do you have like a favorite experience or moment you had within your business? Whether there was like a big client that you booked or I don't know like a goal that you had that you met, that was just really exciting for you.
Speaker 2:I feel like I got my first international wedding.
Speaker 1:So that was fun. That's so fun, oh my gosh.
Speaker 2:Yes, so that was exciting Cause I feel like last year I had to put travel on hold because I had a baby and that comes first. So I just said now to all travel, which was really hard.
Speaker 1:Cause I'm like I thought it was like one of my big goals.
Speaker 2:Then this year I opened it up and I got my first international wedding, which was super fun. That's so exciting. I feel like another moment in like my education space was one of my attendees from my workshop, like, reached out to me and was just telling me how impactful the workshop was and how she is where she is now and she's super successful. Wow, because of what she?
Speaker 2:learned at the workshop and kind of just that lesson that I taught, which to me I didn't think it was impactful, cause I was like it was like one of my first workshops. I'm like I don't know what I'm doing, hopefully people are learning and then ended up being like super impactful for her and now she's hosting her own workshops and she's like killing it, things like mean so much Like, especially when like it's something you're nervous about.
Speaker 1:Yeah, where I'm like.
Speaker 2:Let's hope this has any kind of impact than having someone reach out to you and say that it actually did have an impact. I feel like it was cool.
Speaker 1:Well, I think it just gives more meaning to like yeah, there's a reason I do this. Cause, it's not just about the money. Yeah, I think in this industry it can't just ever be about.
Speaker 2:It can't be, or else you're going to get burnt out Like you have to love it.
Speaker 1:I've had a few inquiries for international weddings and I'm like one of these days someone's gonna, but I'm like at least they're they're asking about. Yeah, you know that's step one, but that is so fun. Is that like stressful for you and like being a place you've never been before and having to like plan it all? Or does the client mostly like the client?
Speaker 2:mostly does like all the planning and Stuff like that. But I feel like it's exciting because I get you in a new place, because I've done several out of state weddings and those are always like my favorite, because I get a go somewhere new, see something new, have new experiences, and I just feel like the out of state, like going somewhere else other than Utah, just like fuels me a little bit. Yeah, just because it's breath of fresh air.
Speaker 2:Breath of fresh air it's not the same venue you've shot at like a million times and I feel like it's just fun to see the different Type of people all around the world.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's super fun, so that's been fun on the note of venues, this is a random one, but do you feel like there's a venue that you really love shooting out, or that you're like, oh, like, this is one I've always wanted to shoot out, like anything like that randomly?
Speaker 2:um, I feel like one of my favorites lately there's been Sam pray. Yeah, I feel like they have a really good lighting. Yeah, they have a gorgeous like everywhere you can take pictures is like a beautiful backdrop, versatility and they're like yeah, they're wedding coordinators. They're awesome to work with and that makes a huge yes.
Speaker 1:For sure for florist like, because we're kind of the behind the scenes. Yeah, if the venue staff is nice, it's like I will be there every week if I you know exactly nothing's worse than like Unkind or like where they're just like. Why are? You, yeah, like, they're like no, you can only come for 30 minutes.
Speaker 1:Oh, I'm like okay, then Okay. So these are a couple floral questions submitted by florist for photographers. If you have any tips for someone who is just trying to take photos at their house of their florals Just for their Instagram, anything like little or big that might make a difference in how their photos show up.
Speaker 2:I feel like if you're trying to get like behind the scenes or just photos to present your work, if you're not like the venue or whatnot at your home, just like find good lighting. I feel like lighting is everything being like next to a close window or Any type of natural light is the best. Don't have your overhead like yellow lights on, or else it's gonna reflect that yellow light off of your white flowers. I make them look yellow. And then like don't have a lot of distractions in the background, like have a clean, easy, just neutral background and not have like all your giant mess in the background.
Speaker 2:I know sometimes it'll be hard when you're a mom just buying like a clean little corner. Yeah, I could even like put up a sheet in the background. I've seen even people just literally setting up a sheet in the background, so they just have a sheet in the background just to set up their own, like florals or Well, and I feel like once you find like your little spot to do, yeah, it's like, and then you can go back to that same spot. Yeah, no, we're figured out, uh-huh.
Speaker 1:Just keep doing it exactly. Um, okay, as far as styled shoots go, any advice on how you feel like a florist could get the most out of that session, whether you know they've been like reached out to to like put it on, or if they're setting it up like any advice for that and getting Photos that they're gonna be really happy with?
Speaker 2:I feel like just communicate really well with your photographer that's hosting that style shoot. Be upfront with them, be like K these are the floors I'm doing. I would like photos of this and this and this in order for it to be a collaboration. Yeah, and if you can't provide that, then just hire me out instead of it being a collaboration. Yeah, cuz I feel like if it's gonna be a collaboration, it should be beneficial for both parties, yes, and if it's not, then like, just hire those vendors. Yeah, if you don't want to provide those photos, just hire them.
Speaker 2:And then I feel like just Communication, like I said, is super key. Like ask the florist how they want them to hold the bouquet, how they want, like, if it's like a floral install, if they're not doing the actual install, the photographers doing the setup, make sure the florist lets them know, like, how they want it to be set up specifically, because with installs they can be. I've I mean, we've worked in several workshops together Like I'm like always asking you okay, where do you want me to put them, how do you want the layout to be?
Speaker 1:and, and I like that, all that stuff appreciated in that aspect. But yeah, a lot of times people don't realize like, yeah, you just need to say it, like, yeah, just communicate with them like what their expectations is and then also like let them know when they can receive, when to expect to receive the photos.
Speaker 2:Yeah, cuz sometimes that expectation, if it's not clearly meant yeah the florist might be like waiting like months and months, and months and like okay, am I ever gonna get these photos, thinking that is gonna be like we received within that first week, yeah.
Speaker 2:So just be upfront and maybe even have like a Written text, or I mean you can do a contract.
Speaker 2:But I feel like with a lot of collaborations I don't necessarily do a contract, I just like have it all in wording with like text or message where it's like okay, you'll receive the gallery within like two to three weeks after the workshop. You can have a full gallery. I include your name and all of the tags. Whenever I post, I include your name with all the stories I post, yeah, and then I put your name in the vendor so all the attendees also have to post your name. It's nice too to like let those, if you're doing collaboration, let those vendors have some creative yeah, cuz I'm like if you have the inspo boards and you're so specific for that style, like you can be a general idea and all that, but let them have creative control, cuz then that vendor can show their creativity, yeah, and want to do it even more, because they could create something that they normally don't have that creative control with some weddings when they're a little bit having to be a little bit more strict.
Speaker 1:Well, that's when I also I'm like if you don't love the project that you're even asked to do, like you should just give them full Price. And you know, that's what I usually do, is if I'm like yeah, I'm not like.
Speaker 2:My heart's not, not hard, not in it.
Speaker 1:Okay, like you know, bouquet is 350 and you know you're welcome to pay me. Yeah, and you know, here's some other people, but I've had to do that a few times and I end up being glad, because there's a few times when I feel like, oh Well, I probably just should, and then I just don't even care. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I'm not, because if it doesn't excite you, then I like it's not beneficial for you. It's more of just a job.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's not like a good marketing yeah for me if I'm like oh yeah, I don't even care, and that's the thing too, because I like a lot of my other vendors. Well, because there are certain vendors that I'll just straight up hire out because I know that they don't really care for the collaboration, yeah, but because, like some makeup artists, they're probably like okay, well, we don't really need Some will do a collaboration, but if you want someone that's really up there and they already are super booked or like they don't care to have more fresh content, so it just kind of depends on which vendors you're going with and if they want to like use their creativity, I always just say, like you know, I think, just go about it.
Speaker 1:And I'm really like nice, like hey, I'm doing this thing, I'd love to work with you, like if it meets your goals, let's collaborate.
Speaker 2:If not, let me know how much your services are so I kind of give both options the option rather than just expecting it.
Speaker 1:Yes, and then I felt like it goes over Better either way where they're not offended that I asked them to do it for free.
Speaker 1:But also, if they are someone who we have those shared Goals, it's like great, let's work together. And yeah, and you can kind of go back to them again and again, which is something I'm sure you do and yeah, I have my, my hair and makeup artists that I'm like, oh, they're always super great to work with. Over chopped them again. Exactly what is something that you appreciate about a vendor, or specifically even a florist, that makes you want to work with them again or recommend them like something that they might do? That's again Like we talked about going above and beyond. That you really recognize is like beneficial for you.
Speaker 2:I feel like like communication, because whenever I see a vendor reach out to me and be like, hey, like I noticed that you did this wedding.
Speaker 2:I would love to see the gallery when it's finished, here's like my information to send it over. Or like they come up to me during the wedding day and introduce themselves, sometimes, like, you don't even run like see the vendors. Like, as a photographer, it's rarely when I see the florist yeah, the floor shows up, they set up and then they leave before sometimes I even get there. Sometimes I see them, but whenever they like come up, introduce themselves, tell me about, like their Instagram handle or yeah. And then when they post my work, like Making sure to tag me, because if I took the photo, if I send them the gallery, tagging me is always yes. Or even if I like post one of my photos and I forget to tag like the florist because I didn't even know who it was, because, like, the couple never gave me that Information. Usually I try to ask, like for a vendor list from my couple, but if they didn't end up submitting the vendor list, then I don't know.
Speaker 2:I'm like so please reach out and be like hey, those are, I did that floor is like then, it's totally fine, I go back and tag them yeah.
Speaker 1:I like just communicating. That's one of those things. A lot of times people will be like that'll assume it's bad intent if they haven't been tagged yeah but a lot of times I'm like, yeah, brides, yeah, what's going on?
Speaker 1:and we can ask them for the same thing over and over, which is why I started directly Messaging photographers asking for a gallery, because, even though it's in my contract that I like to receive the gallery, that I want to be tagged, they just don't they forget and the brides forget, and then we also forget, like because I do try to send my gallery to all the vendors, but like after when you send the wedding gallery out, yeah, sometimes just like it's out of mind.
Speaker 2:It's like I've completed it, it's been sent out. And then you're like, oh wait, I need to send it to all the vendors. Yeah. But then, once the floors reaches out to me like, hey, can I have that gallery from that wedding? Yeah, then great. And I feel like, if it's like a week after the wedding hey, do you have the gallery for the wedding?
Speaker 2:You're like no well, it's only been a week. But here's like, if I post a sneak peek, then like I'll send you the like people the sneak peek, but I'm like the gallery's not done. She definitely know better. Yes, around times or a lot longer.
Speaker 1:But yeah, I feel like I've also had people asking me before, like a lot of times. It's a newer floor. It's like I never got photos and I'm just nervous to reach out. I don't want to, you know, offend anyone for asking and I'm like I don't think anyone's gonna be like mad at you for wanting to share their word.
Speaker 2:No, like I'm not photographer, she will send the gallery to the vendors.
Speaker 1:Yes, as long as they're being tagged, incredibly like no one's really gonna have an issue with it. Yeah, but I usually just go directly to the photographer and ask for it or, just like you said, say like hey. Just you know, I did the flowers for this girl Because, if you think about it too, a lot of times like I don't know who the photographer is either. So, like I just wait to see the bride post right, post it. And then I'm like, oh okay.
Speaker 2:Now you can go to it. You're like we know there's photos available, yeah, so I can go find them. Most photographers, yeah, are definitely willing to send over the photos. I think the only really Stipulation on like sharing photos with other vendors is like if those vendors use those photos for like Advertising or advertising without crediting you. Because I've had a vendor once reach out to me be like, hey, Can I use this photo for my bill, a billboard? Yeah, I was like, okay, well, is it gonna have like any like photo credit? They're like well, we can either add the photo credit. So it's like you can either add photo credit or pay me, because I'm like, other than that there's no mutual, yes, well, and I type of that's one of the things, contract-wise, that vendors don't think about like I, yeah, I work for a company that this happened to one time where they used a photo for the advertisement and didn't ask the photographer.
Speaker 1:and Like I, I can understand, like not realizing, yeah but I think people are unaware.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like.
Speaker 1:I don't know, unless you've signed a contract for a photographer, you might not know what's in it, what's included. Yeah, you know, like it's pretty easy.
Speaker 2:Yeah it's like all. But I think a lot of people, yeah, are just unaware of that. Well, I think they're like oh, the bride paid for the photos, so so these photos are mine to use for whatever.
Speaker 1:I want.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because they're still have that. Yeah, still have some copyright laws on it.
Speaker 1:So that's always good for people to know.
Speaker 2:You can't just do whatever you want with the photo.
Speaker 1:Exactly, um, okay, okay, okay, okay. Do you have a either a specific horror story where like something just like really did not go well with a client, or just generally something you see commonly happened that has helped you to like change your business practices Whether you change your contract or maybe how you do things with a client, to avoid it happening ever again?
Speaker 2:So luckily, like I've been doing weddings for a while, I actually don't have like any horse.
Speaker 1:That's so.
Speaker 2:I am very lucky like I've had like a lot of photography friends and they're telling me, like all these crazy, Stories and. I'm like well, I'm glad I've never had someone threaten to sue me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh my gosh.
Speaker 2:Yes. So I'm like I'm lucky, I've never had that. But I feel like the main thing is just miscommunication. So I feel like I'm always trying to be super upfront, because if a client, like, has this expectation and they don't communicate it to you and they're just expecting you to perform in a certain way or take certain photos, yeah, and that just miscommunication. You is not like met and you don't meet that expectation, then I feel like that's the reason why clients end up unhappy or a horror story is just usually over that, yeah. So I always like send my clients like a questionnaire. I want to know exactly what they expect, like all the details, and their family drama is important as well.
Speaker 1:I mean, I don't need to know all their family drama.
Speaker 2:But if there's like a divorced parent and you don't know that and you go and put them in this like cutesy, like Parent pose, they're gonna be pissed.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's gonna be an awkward one, yes, so that one.
Speaker 2:I'm like that's something so easy to avoid. Just ask upfront Are your parents married or divorced? Is there bad tension? Can they be in the same photo type thing? So you don't exactly, because that's always an awkward situation.
Speaker 1:That's one reason I personally I only will email my clients and a lot of times they want to call me and I'm like listen, I know it's fun to call, but like I need I need it in writing, and it's nice having writing too, because we forget.
Speaker 2:So it's nice to go over everything Rather than trying to remember what they said over the phone, because I usually do a final cons like a booking consultation call with my clients. And then a final consultation, but then I have everything and writing on their questionnaire with everything they need and what they want. Yeah, on that questionnaire. So that's like my main bullet point. And then the final console call is mainly for like going through it all going through it all.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and I think that's great. I do the same thing. We're like we initially chat, then I give them all the info, and then we'll kind of go back and forth for a while and then we'll touch base and usually and I'm like, okay, look at it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I make sure it looks good before we sign it. Did I miss anything?
Speaker 1:Yes, that would be super bad. Okay, any like trends or common like requests that you're getting more of right now that you're really loving.
Speaker 2:I feel like now, which I've been loving, to seeing the trend as more like smaller, intimate weddings. Yeah, and I am for it. I'm like you don't need a million people at your wedding, that you have no idea who they are. I mean, it's great for gifts but, who are you doing?
Speaker 1:it for yes, exactly, so I'm like.
Speaker 2:I love seeing the more small, intimate weddings where it's like they're closest friends and family, like the most important people are there and then, if they don't know the person, just send them a gift.
Speaker 1:It's funny. I've been seeing a lot more of that too. Yeah, even with, like, smaller bridal parties. Yeah, I've been having more of my brides, like oh, I just have two bridesmaids, like just really cutting it down to like these are the two Most important people rather than like the obligatory.
Speaker 2:I have 15 bridesmaids because, yeah, I need to include everyone. I know or you know, so what so had?
Speaker 1:me do theirs. And now. I have to do them, and I always just feel bad when a bride is doing something again like for someone else rather than for her.
Speaker 2:You need to have a guilt or because you genuinely yeah, I'm like just do your wedding the way you want and not any obligation to anyone else because I feel like that's I see I've been seeing a lot more too is the brides are just like doing what they envision, what they want. Yeah, and I love that.
Speaker 1:I'm like I just think, yeah, you can just see that, like the bride is so excited, yeah, and even if it's, I think for a long time there was this like I don't know. I think I don't know how to describe it, but I think a lot of brides out of fear of, like, well, I don't want this to be tacky in five years.
Speaker 2:Or like oh. I don't want to be embarrassed when I look back, but I think, the more I'm like everything is dated, everything is going to go out and it will come back, like oh, yeah, but don't do your wedding in a way that's not authentic to you just because you're like afraid of how it's gonna age, going out of style, because I'm like, if I look back on my wedding, oh my gosh, it's so out of style yeah, which probably wasn't even that long ago, it was almost nine years.
Speaker 1:Okay, like that's not that long, yeah, but it's like.
Speaker 2:It like almost makes me cringe thinking about it because it is so out of style, but I had the best day. I'm like.
Speaker 1:I had so much fun and give it 15 more years and then it will be the exact same thing. Like it's just and I think that's one of the things that actually fascinates me about I mean, it's like fashion-wide.
Speaker 1:But the wedding industry is like you know, we see things go out and in and it's just so funny because, like, we'll just recycle through the same few concepts every few years and it's just kind of funny to see. Like you know, the puffs leave was the big fat joke for so long. Yeah, wedding dresses, and now it's like making a comeback. The puffs leave is like, had its big moment and like it's just so interesting, because I'm like yeah, like nothing is.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and the big bows too. Those were big. The bow was like the huge, like the giant bows on the back of the dress or in the hair. They did that.
Speaker 1:It's all coming from somewhere. Um okay, is there anything else that you want to share?
Speaker 2:um, I just feel like just having a good Communication and relationship with vendors. I feel like it's so important in the wedding industry and I feel like people like Regard that a little bit. I feel like they don't really care to get to know who all put their work and efforts into the wedding. Yeah, they just care about the clients. But I feel like we're we're basically a team. Yes, I feel like people don't think about Like all the vendors as a team. Yeah, it's like you're the photographer.
Speaker 2:You're the videographer, like sometimes they think it's the photographer and videographer as a team and then everyone else is just on their own. On their own, and putting their work together to create this wedding. But I'm like, if you think about it, we all worked as a team to create this wedding, for the client.
Speaker 1:Well, and I think that's such a big reason why it's been like such a hot topic in like the publishing industry of, like it's a big deal to give credit to all the vendors. Yeah, just like the whole team you know the main, you know photographer and planner, like it's a huge deal because, yeah, like all these vendors work so hard, yeah, on their, on their one aspect, to make, like their Multiple pieces become one big.
Speaker 2:Without each one like, you're not gonna have the whole the entire wedding like it. You need all the moving pieces for it.
Speaker 1:Well and I think that's also like we kind of talked about like it's Clients are gonna come from referrals and a lot of times, like clients will ask me like, hey, I need a caterer and I'm not from Utah. Like who do you recommend? So I think vendors might even forget.
Speaker 1:Like I have a lot of poll too, like you know you might get a client from me because you know she needs someone local to Utah and I have my friends, so you want to make sure you leave a good like yeah, impact on someone rather than like being rude or you know.
Speaker 2:I don't know like if you have a chance.
Speaker 1:I just always try, like you said, like if I have a chance to see anybody like hey, yeah, because I always go.
Speaker 2:If I see any vendors, like when I show up, I always go and try to introduce myself and get their instagram handle follow them, and then if I post anything like to my story about that wedding, I try and go and tag them that night just to show that like, hey, I remembered who you are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, which is so nice?
Speaker 2:Yes and it kind of just shows them like that they were a part of that wedding and it wasn't just the clients that were a part of the wedding, like we all worked our butts off to make this wedding come to life for this couple.
Speaker 1:Well, and I think a lot of times too, like certain ideas might even have come from the vendors. Yeah, it might have been something that was encouraged by a photographer like hey, what if we did this thing? And so I think that's another reason like it's so important to like give credit words, to like everyone's involved, and it's also great for, like Um, promoting yourself as well, like I know it's for the vendor too.
Speaker 2:But like, if you tag all those vendors, more likely they're gonna reshare it to their story because they worked on that wedding and they want to show that wedding Also to their followers. So if you tag them on their story and they reshare it, like that's gonna benefit you as well, so it's a mutual benefit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, huge reason why.
Speaker 2:It's just funny to me when vendors won't Tag, yeah, I'm like, it's like it's actually benefiting both of you guys and that's like a really good way to even grow your social media. It's like tagging every vendor that's involved in whatever shoot, whatever Wedding like that you do, and it they will share it.
Speaker 1:It just helps you to. Yeah, I'll show up more for potential clients on instagram who are looking to book. So yeah. I think so. So everything to what you said.
Speaker 2:I agree with.
Speaker 1:Um, okay, so make sure to tell us where we can find you on instagram If anyone wants to take a class from you or workshop education, where can we find all that stuff?
Speaker 2:So I my handle is jenny pearl photography and that's my main photography account, um, and then I'm also hosting a workshop that we still have a few tickets left, april 27th, which we get it.
Speaker 1:Yes, great together. Work together, it's gonna be so fun.
Speaker 2:It's like one that I'm really excited about, but I feel like this market's been so weird so I'm like I don't. It's more for like, being creative and creating something beautiful and, like the Slower season, I feel like I want to to be able to create something beautiful in the slower season, pretty springy yes. I know the orchard's gonna be in full bloom that week it's gonna be so cool, but yeah. I love that, so that can also be found on my page too. To sign up Awesome.
Speaker 1:Well, thank you so much for coming. I am so excited that we got to chat and talk in a less chaotic scenario of like a photo shoot or wedding? Um, but yeah, thanks for coming, thank you for having me.